Help Teach

Help Teach: Episode 2 - To PE or Not To PE

Mihai Covaser: [00:00:00] Welcome, learners and learned alike, to Help Teach.

Mihai Covaser: Hello and welcome to our community audio project. I am your host, editor, producer, and project co-lead: Mihai Covaser. I am also a youth living with a physical disability. My most formative experiences living with a disability have come in the Canadian public education system. Many students like me, with physical, emotional, or mental challenges, go through their years of schooling lacking the supports and accommodations they need to partake of the same opportunities offered to their peers. The vision of this project is to provide educators in Canadian classrooms, students with disabilities, and members of the general public, with the tools and knowledge they need to make our institutions more accessible and inclusive for all. Join me and a diverse cast of guests as we explore perspectives on disabilities and education in this podcast series. [00:01:00] One last message for you teachers tuning in: Listen in each episode for our key takeaway that you can implement in your classroom today to help us further this vision.

Mihai Covaser: Without further ado, I’d love to introduce our guest for today’s episode: Maggie Manning. Hello, Maggie.

Maggie Manning: Hi. Good morning.

Mihai Covaser: Great to have you on today. So why don’t you just start by telling us a little bit about yourself, you know, what are you doing right now, where are you situated, what’s going on with you?

Maggie Manning: Yeah, so I’m currently in Kamloops, B.C., and I am in my fourth year of university–I’m taking respiratory therapy–so I am in full course work right now. It’s definitely challenging, but it’s a very rewarding career. I am also a youth living with a physical disability. I was born with developmental dysplasia of the hip [00:02:00] and so I’ve had twelve surgeries on my hips to kinda reconstruct them, so that I can get a better quality of life.

Mihai Covaser: Mhm, mhm. Well, thank you for that. You know, I think, for the first half of this episode today, there’s a couple of things I wanted to touch on with you. And you sort of started to mention it here, about just how involved it can be to live with a disability and to have to go through the procedures or the treatments or what it is to, as you say, raise our quality of life. So I’d love to talk a little bit about, you know, living with a disability as a long-term thing, as a journey, so why don’t you tell me a little bit about that? How does it feel for you, in terms of looking back on your experiences so far; how does that feel for you, you know, to have that be as a journey? I know that’s something you mentioned to me.

Maggie Manning: Yeah, so it’s… [00:03:00] Living with a disability is obviously challenging; it has its own unique barriers that it comes with and depending on the disability, everybody’s different. For me, a lot of times it’s been participation and accessibility within the built environment, so having ramps and having railings and stairs, and that type of thing so… There’s definitely a host of different challenges that come with it, but ultimately, I really look at my disability as a positive thing. I am so thankful for all the friendships like you and all my other friends that have come from living with a disability. It’s something that’s really unique and I’d like to talk about it more, but the disability community and kind of finding a niche within this minority… Yeah, it’s something that’s really hard to explain to a lot of able-bodied people because it’s just like there’s this [00:04:00] underlying understanding that comes within the disabled community.

Mihai Covaser: Yeah, that’s so interesting. You know, that’s something that I never really… I always experienced it as well, with a bit of surprise, the fact that I had to tell people that and explain to people in a way that they could understand, that living with a disability has benefits or has like, at least aspects to it that are much like living in any other community, or as you say, any other niche in society. Which is to say that, yeah, we have our challenges, we know what those are, I mean, we don’t see living with a disability as a strictly positive thing, but at the same time, as you say, there are so many sort of friendships and niches and all kinds of things that you can find along the way that really… I don’t know, help you to flourish as a human being, much like you do in any other situation. And it’s interesting, you know, as you say, to have to talk to people about that [00:05:00] and have them change their perspective on that.

Maggie Manning: Totally, yeah. I mean, I think it’s really important to acknowledge, like, the disabled community, too, and how special those connections can be. I recently just came back from a sledge or para ice hockey camp and because of COVID, I hadn’t been with this disabled community for so long, almost three years, and going back this weekend, it was so rejuvenating because it was just like, “I’m with my people,” and like I can just have fun and be myself and it was really awesome.

Mihai Covaser: Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And it really helps to have the opportunity to… Having a community is interesting because it means it really promotes wellbeing in that you have a place where you’re understood, right? Like you have a place where you don’t [00:06:00] have to explain everything, where you don’t have to sort of tread on glass when it comes to, you know, having conversations and being worried about how you’ll be treated and all that kind of thing. And as you say, there are so many–I mean, I myself have done a couple of adapted sports as well, I mean, I do adapted tae kwon do, and it’s so interesting to, as you say, to just have that place to go and to talk to people, and they get it, right? And they all participate and include you as such, which is really great.

Maggie Manning: Mhm. I think that when experiences like being back with that community this weekend… It was like, we were getting changed in the dressing room and I just happened to fall, which is something that happens to me because I have the kind of balance that sometimes goes off, and if that had happened in front of a lot of my able-bodied friends, they’d be coming over and going, “Oh, my gosh, are you okay?” And it’s so embarrassing, whereas with this, we all just laugh [00:07:00] because it was so funny, because we all have that experience where all of a sudden it’s just like, we’re on the floor.

Mihai Covaser: You know, that’s so interesting, I never had an experience like that, so it’s really interesting to hear, because no, you’re right. I mean, I used to go through elementary school, especially, when–My balance has improved over time, right. As I mentioned in the first episode, for people who are–or maybe for people who are just tuning in, I live with cerebral palsy. It’s a variation called spastic diplegia, which means my legs, so muscles in my legs are stiffer than they should be and that affects how I walk. So yeah, when I was little, balance and coordination wasn’t as great, and so, yeah, I’d fall, especially in places where you wouldn’t expect things like concrete staircases and all that kind of thing, and I’d take a spill, and all my friends would be like, “Oh, my God!” or you know, “Are you okay? What’s going on?” And I’d get up and be like, “I don’t see a scratch, I don’t see a bruise, like I do this every day. I’m good.”

Maggie Manning: Just another day.

Mihai Covaser: Yeah, yeah. And you know, one other thing I wanted to touch on [00:08:00] with you, speaking of sort of having a community and building those experiences over time, is how do we get here? How do we get to the point of advocating as youths with disabilities for other youths with disabilities? Because I think that’s something super interesting that, you know… Because it seems almost that people are under the assumption that either you have no way of becoming an advocate or you have no way of sort of engaging in experiences like this or all people with disabilities necessarily do something like this, right, without any in-between. So how did you come to advocating in your own personal experience?

Maggie Manning: You know, that’s a really tough question because there’s so many different avenues you can go down to become an advocate and I think initially, the concept of being an advocate is super daunting because you feel like–You almost feel like you’re representing a huge group of people, but in reality, it could just be [00:09:00] like you’re just representing yourself and through that, hopefully you’re helping the greater population. For me personally, I really enjoy sharing my lived experience, so sharing what it’s like to be a disabled person and to be living in society with some physical challenges that a lot of people don’t have. And there is also a lot of people in the disabled community who don’t have a voice and who don’t have advocates, so to be able to be that voice and to push towards more accessibility and inclusion in Canada, specifically, is really important.

Mihai Covaser: You know, I really love a couple of the things you said there. First of all, that you’re just representing yourself. You know, I mean, I’ve always had as a motto for myself when I go to fundraising events, or when I host initiatives on my own, to show people what we can do, rather than what we cannot do, and to sort of shift that focus. [00:10:00] And I really love how you phrased that, that you’re really just being–You don’t have to be a symbol for all people with disabilities, say, in the country, in order to be an advocate, because you can’t be, right, everyone has their own lived experience and their own unique stories. The ability for us to just share ours…I think that was really well put; I really appreciate that. And you’re right, not everyone can or wants to do that, and that’s okay, too. I mean, as long as you’re able to engage and connect with people that can help you to access those resources that you need and to raise your quality of life, and to achieve the goals that you have as an individual in a society, I think that’s what really matters and that’s what we’re aiming for, right, so it’s a privilege to be able to do that for people.

Maggie Manning: Totally.

Mihai Covaser: And you know, you mentioned also–We started talking a little bit about disability sports [00:11:00] and I think that’s a great segue into what we wanna talk about next, so why don’t we take a little break here, and when we come back–don’t go anywhere, audience members–when we come back, we’re going to be talking about PE class and the adaptations that need to be made in the school system for people with physical disabilities like myself and Maggie, so we’ll be right back. Don’t go anywhere.

Mihai Covaser: Welcome back to Help Teach. In this episode, I’m talking to Maggie Manning, and we’re just about to get on the subject of PE class. Oh, boy! What a subject for us, eh, Maggie?

Maggie Manning: Oh, yes.

Mihai Covaser: So, the reason Maggie and I are laughing here is–It’s sort of–It’s almost an inside joke amongst youths living with physical disabilities, that PE class in a public school system is just… [00:12:00] It’s an adventure. It’s something otherworldly. So I’ll leave it to you, Maggie, to start off here. What do you want to tell us about that? What’s your experience been like?

Maggie Manning: Yeah, you know, it is definitely almost an inside joke, and unfortunately that is what it is, because PE class is so difficult, especially in the public school system, for those living with disabilities. So for me, I was never able to really participate past grade four or five in normal PE activities, and that was mainly just due to going through surgeries and treatment and not being able to physically keep up with my peers at that point, and so the option was to sit at the side. And that was what I did for most of PE and that’s how I got my credits for it being a required class up until high school. [00:13:00] Yeah, it’s definitely challenging. Once I got to high school, you only had to do it until grade 10, so I did two years of what they call “online physical education”, which–I don’t know how that works, but it definitely was a very unique experience.

Mihai Covaser: Yeah. No, I’ve done some online PE myself. For students out there that are listening, even, yes, that is a thing you can do, is PE online. Don’t tell your teachers, but we recommend it! It works! If you have some kind of challenges with doing PE at school. But, no, that aspect of sitting on the side, I mean… We were talking about advocacy, right, in our first half, and that’s what really set me on my journey. Back in grade four–and I’ll remember this, probably for the rest of my life–but they brought in a karate master, right, to our class to do a demonstration, do a demo class of punching and kicking and self-defense and all that kind of thing, [00:14:00] and naturally, at my age and my stage of development then, it just wasn’t something that I could do. And there was no plan B, there was no backup, and so I ended up spending that entire gym class on a bench, on the far side of the gym, away from the class, watching everyone participate. And you know, I came home, I mean, feeling shunned, honestly, feeling like I just didn’t belong there, and that’s really one of the key moments that set me on this journey to change education for students like me. Not just in gym class, but in all aspects. Yeah, no, you’re right, it’s–The bench is probably one of the monsters of experience for youths like us. But–

Maggie Manning: It totally is.

Mihai Covaser: Yeah, no, go ahead, if you had something to say there.

Maggie Manning: No, I was just gonna say, it totally is kinda the monster [00:15:00] and I think, for me, I really struggled with it because outside of school, I was competing on an international level with the Canadian national team for swimming, and I was looked at as such an athlete and so ambitious and with physical education, but if I go into class in PE, I would just be sitting on the sidelines, and it was so hard to be like, “I know I’m a super athletic person–but not with my peers.”

Mihai Covaser: Absolutely. I mean, I think that’s key, right, for anyone listening: how does that happen? That a national-level swimming athlete like Maggie here can’t or is not allowed, or is not supported in doing PE? I mean, where is that disconnect coming from? And you know, what I really like to say on this issue, is that it’s not like it’s all the teacher’s fault or anything like that. [00:16:00] And that’s something I like to make super clear when I make these talks, right, because, you know, it’s easy to point fingers and start blaming people and say, “Oh, the teachers are so mean and they don’t let us participate.” But it’s incredibly difficult to be a teacher nowadays, you know, and to be faced with all kinds of youth with varying abilities in your classroom and no training, right? No onhand resources, no help from administration, to manage everybody; well, that’s–It’s a Herculean task, right, so for any educators listening, we’re not–We understand perfectly how difficult it is for you to make this happen, but, you know, ideally, in giving you some of these messages and these key takeaways, we can give you a hand.

Maggie Manning: It is definitely a larger systemic problem; it’s not just a one school or one teacher, it’s largely across the country, and I know across North America, at least. [00:17:00]

Mihai Covaser: Mhm, mhm. But, you know, it’s not all bad, either. We were talking earlier and you were mentioning some of the opportunities that you’ve gotten to have through other organizations at your school. Wanna touch on those?

Maggie Manning: Yeah, for sure. So I think one of the most memorable PE experiences I ever had was in grade seven, where I walked into PE class, ready to go sit on the bench in the corner of the gym, and right in front of me sat about twenty wheelchair basketball sports wheelchairs. And I was like, “No way. There can’t–Like what is happening here?” It was shocking, honestly, to see an accessible PE class. I didn’t know this was happening, so I went and got changed because I knew I was gonna be able to participate this gym class, and it turns out that there’s some programs through B.C. Wheelchair Basketball Foundation [00:18:00] and Let’s Play, and it’s also sponsored by the Rick Hansen Foundation. And they bring sports wheelchairs to districts across British Columbia so that people can get–not just the disabled students, but the whole class can get an experience with adaptive sports.

Mihai Covaser: That’s awesome, you know. It must have been shocking, right, just to have that kind of experience. Yeah, no, I remember–This was in grade six now, so a couple years after the events that I’d mentioned about the karate instructor, is when my tae kwon do master was invited to the school to do–this wasn’t in gym class, this was sort of an extra after-school thing–He was invited to do a little demo of tae kwon do. And you know, now, as I’d been getting better with my balance and everything, and I was determined after that experience to sort of try something new. I went to go see it [00:19:00] and absolutely, it changed my path, and now I’m getting ready, actually, for my black belt test in the next couple of months here in adaptive tae kwon do. And it just–It’s fantastic, right, how one organization or one event or one person can really set you on a different path.

Maggie Manning: It really is, you know, after that day, when my friends got to experience what it was like to have–to take part in and have the opportunity to sit in a wheelchair and propel themselves and understand something I would go through on a daily basis…They completely had their viewpoint on disability shifted and were like, “Wow, like this is actually its own very unique sport; this doesn’t have to just be for adaptive sports, and like this is a lot of fun.” And you know, from that week forward, that week that we had those chairs and we were allowed to go in that lunchtime and use them, play around with our friends, it was just… [00:20:00] It changed their viewpoint on disabilities, too, and at a young age, that is so important, and then going forward, they definitely were more advocating for inclusion and wanting to get me in PE and be a part of their games, because it is possible.

Mihai Covaser: Outstanding. So you would say that that event really created lasting change in your experience in your community, right?

Maggie Manning: Yeah, definitely.

Mihai Covaser: Mhm, mhm. And that’s really key, you know, to be able to engage–And you know, there are so many schools that are underfunded, that are understaffed, that just don’t have the kind of capability to do these kind of events, but at the same time, there are so many resources, some of which I’ll just rattle off here for you educators listening to take a look at. Rick Hansen Foundation, first and foremost. As representatives of the organization, Maggie and I both know how great that they are, in terms of the resources that they provide. Ambassadorship, presentations, you know, sort of “bite-size lessons”, they call them [00:21:00] for the classroom, all kinds of wealth of resources that you can use, that just give you those tools, right, to be able to have your peers, or your students, who are, you know, both with and without disabilities, to learn more about the issue and to make that change. So Rick Hansen Foundation is great for it. Like Maggie said, B.C. Wheelchair Foundation–Wheelchair Basketball Foundation…they are another group that does events like these, and many adaptive sports have their own representation and their own groups out there that you can take a look at. Let’s Play, as Maggie mentioned, and many others, so we’ll make sure to keep updating that list for you in future episodes, but those are some great places to start to just do a bit of research and see what’s going on in the world of adaptive sports. So then, why don’t we take it to–seeing as we’re running out of time here–why don’t we take it to our key takeaway for educators for this episode? [00:22:00] I’ll give you the honors, Maggie, if you would like, why don’t you tell teachers what they can do?

Maggie Manning: Yeah, of course. So when you look at things you can do to adapt a PE class, it can be very daunting, and I totally understand that, because every child has their own needs, and obviously, like we mentioned earlier, it’s a lot to deal with, especially when you’re undersupported and underfunded. And so one of the things that I think could be really helpful is making a list of those students who need adaptations, knowing who they are, identifying them, and having a conversation with them about what they do need to do to get involved in this PE class, because ultimately it’s not about getting that thirty minutes of exercise in; it’s about including everybody, so they all feel welcome and included, and you have accessible education. And so it could be something as simple as giving a student a headstart in dodgeball [00:23:00] so that they can all get going at the same time, and you know, it doesn’t have to be anything complicated.

Mihai Covaser: Mhm, mhm. So just to reiterate that for you educators, just make a list, maybe, at the beginning of the year, when you plan your class as a PE teacher, or maybe in-between, say–even the night before you plan your next gym class. You know you wanna play dodgeball in the next class to get kids moving around. Take a look: who do you have in your class and what do they need? If you took our advice from last episode, you will have had a conversation with them to identify what their needs are, generally speaking, get to know them a little bit, and just make a quick list, right? What can I do to help them? Can I give them a couple of dodgeballs that are not on the center line, so that they can start back on their side and they don’t have to run back and forth, and they can get that headstart and get in the game, right? So just make a list of those students and make a list of a couple small adjustments for the next sport or game you plan to play, and honestly, it just takes a few minutes of your time, and I think that it can really be a [00:24:00] foundational moment, a really changing moment for students to get that experience and to be included in that way.

Maggie Manning: Yeah, and I just wanted to point out that some things that small make such a huge difference in the life of somebody living with a disability, just like Mihai said, and also my story; they both started around sports and PE, and it’s definitely an area that’s being worked on, but that is also progressing significantly, so something small can have a very large, lasting change.

Mihai Covaser: Well, I really appreciate you coming on for this conversation, Maggie. It was great to have you, and thank you very much for your insight.

Maggie Manning: Yeah, thank you for having me.

Mihai Covaser: You’ve just heard another episode of the community audio project, Help Teach. I’d like to give a huge thank you to my other co-leads on this project, Payton Given, Maggie Manning, Elise Doucet, and Alexis Holmgren, [00:25:00] all youth leaders at the Rick Hansen Foundation, who I’d also like to thank for their continued support in this initiative and others. Big thank you to Every Canadian Counts and their #RisingYouth initiative for funding this project. I’d like to give a huge shout-out to our community mentor for this project, Charl Coetzee, and to our professional contact for helping in the editing process, Chester Hull. My name is Mihai Covaser. I am your host, editor, and producer for this podcast series, and you can look forward to finding this podcast on Spotify and Apple Podcasts soon. Also, in the show description, on either site, you will be able to find a link directly to my website, where we will be posting transcripts for each episode for whoever would like to access those, and any further links to other resources will also be put in the show description. So everything that I talked about in this episode, you can find handy in the notes once we post it. Tune in next time for more great conversations and key takeaways that you educators can implement in the classroom today, [00:26:00] to make it a more accessible and inclusive place for all. Thank you for listening, and I’ll see you next time.